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Well, do you?

Post your thoughts.

As a concept that merely refers to the outcomes of chance events, sure. As an inherent property that someone or something can possess—or that can be altered or influenced—of course not.

no. XD.

I'm a firm believer in fate. I think that might preclude luck.

It really depends on how you define Luck, like ortsz said. Of all pairs of events that might happen approximately at the same time, a portion of them happen on a schedule that's very, very convenient. Of the people who might witness such events, a portion of them have experienced more of them than most everyone else. These people are who we'd call lucky, but it by no means implies that they will continue to be so. Some of them will and some of them won't (and those who will would probably, unfortunately, think they have some characteristic that causes these conveniences).

Pheidippides wrote:I'm a firm believer in fate. I think that might preclude luck.

I am, too, but in the same jaded manner that I think of luck. I believe in a functionally clockwork universe, and that every event that'll ever happen (assuming the universe is closed and isolated, obviously) was determined at the beginning of time. And I'd also hesitate to say that there's anything we can "do about it," because I don't see that as applicable in the way I think of fate. It's certainly nothing that caters to humans specifically, nor does it work in terms of our understanding of reality / our human abstractions.

I don't want to believe in luck, persay, because I don't think I am more likely to win at roulette than any other person. However, as an arbitrary summation of how my life has been so far, I would describe it as very lucky, because most things work out for me and I am given ample opportunities. So, while luck is not an active property, I believe that there is something to be said that the natural order of things will benefit some people more than others.

SlappyMcGee wrote:I don't want to believe in luck, persay, because I don't think I am more likely to win at roulette than any other person. However, as an arbitrary summation of how my life has been so far, I would describe it as very lucky, because most things work out for me and I am given ample opportunities. So, while luck is not an active property, I believe that there is something to be said that the natural order of things will benefit some people more than others.

Right. Because life is not fair.

Tsukatu wrote:

SlappyMcGee wrote:I don't want to believe in luck, persay, because I don't think I am more likely to win at roulette than any other person. However, as an arbitrary summation of how my life has been so far, I would describe it as very lucky, because most things work out for me and I am given ample opportunities. So, while luck is not an active property, I believe that there is something to be said that the natural order of things will benefit some people more than others.

Right. Because life is not fair.

And that very statement implies some aspect of difference between two peeps.

I believe that some individuals may act in a way that causes them to noticed things i.e. a 5 dollar bill on the ground
that may be perceived as "lucky" but I don't believe that people have luck as in they would win at any non-skill game or activity more then the average person might/would.
*edit*
This should be moved to general discussion.

jinxed_07 wrote:This should be moved to general discussion.

Says the guy who posted a YouTube argument in Politics & Debate. Please don't backseat mod. Thank you.

Nope. In almost every case, you can predict things like dice rolls (by calculating the force of the throw, the direction, the surface, etc).
One example this further applies to is say, a story about a woman who's entire family died in a car crash, but she missed it because she wasn't feeling well. If you analyzed everyone's mental/physical wiring and their environment, you can in fact predict their actions in advance... if someone was truly omniscient, they would have known that because of the woman's experiences and decisions, she would work in a preschool, and because there was a strand of a virus on one of the children, she'd get sick, and that she'd make the decision to stay home because of past experience/mental wiring. And looking at the decisions/environment of the drunk driver killing her family, we can in the same way predict that he'll be driving at an exact speed down an exact street and will coincide with the family at an exact moment. Now, it's impossible to look at all these variables and predict an accurate outcome to the future, but regardless, every decision we make (and every action that results) is hardwired by internal and external factors.

Amadeus wrote:Nope. In almost every case, you can predict things like dice rolls (by calculating the force of the throw, the direction, the surface, etc).

Probabilities are cool. They predict the likelihood of something presumably random happening. A diceroll is not a good example because a dice roll is entirely figured by the physical interactions it makes and these can be controlled. However, to say that a Human has complete control over a dice rolling is a little ludicrous. Nobody has that force and dexterity and control of their hand, or a high enough grasp of physics to determine just how the dice is going to roll. So, since this is neither mentally controlled by us nor predetermined by a set of probabilities, this brings up an interesting question; what is the determining factor that makes a dice land six for a guy and earn him a million bucks? Is this not luck?

SlappyMcGee wrote:

Amadeus wrote:Nope. In almost every case, you can predict things like dice rolls (by calculating the force of the throw, the direction, the surface, etc).

Probabilities are cool. They predict the likelihood of something presumably random happening. A diceroll is not a good example because a dice roll is entirely figured by the physical interactions it makes and these can be controlled. However, to say that a Human has complete control over a dice rolling is a little ludicrous. Nobody has that force and dexterity and control of their hand, or a high enough grasp of physics to determine just how the dice is going to roll.

What about that guy from the newest Wolverine movie. The one with the cards. He strikes me as a likely candidate.

Gambit, motherfuckers.

SlappyMcGee wrote:Gambit, motherfuckers.

Damn. I was thinking Bandit.

flagmyidol wrote:

SlappyMcGee wrote:Gambit, motherfuckers.

Damn. I was thinking Bandit.

Dammit, I hate it when Slaps beats me to answers. ;_;

Anyway. I'm unsure. Part of me agrees with luck, and another part does. I mean, I know people who i would consider lucky, yet... I dunno, i still have doubt, in some deep, dark, corner of my mind. Conversely, I know people who I would consider unlucky, and the same thing applies.

It all depends on the situation, though. In Amedeus' example, one could say that the woman is, in fact, unlucky, because her entirely family died all at once, leaving her all alone in the world, instead of being taken out with the rest of them. I mean, that's how I'd feel, anyway.

Might wrote:

flagmyidol wrote:

SlappyMcGee wrote:Gambit, motherfuckers.

Damn. I was thinking Bandit.

Dammit, I hate it when Slaps beats me to answers. ;_;

Anyway. I'm unsure. Part of me agrees with luck, and another part does. I mean, I know people who i would consider lucky, yet... I dunno, i still have doubt, in some deep, dark, corner of my mind. Conversely, I know people who I would consider unlucky, and the same thing applies.

It all depends on the situation, though. In Amedeus' example, one could say that the woman is, in fact, unlucky, because her entirely family died all at once, leaving her all alone in the world, instead of being taken out with the rest of them. I mean, that's how I'd feel, anyway.

Oh god, now luck is an opinion....

Probabilities are cool. They predict the likelihood of something presumably random happening. A diceroll is not a good example because a dice roll is entirely figured by the physical interactions it makes and these can be controlled. However, to say that a Human has complete control over a dice rolling is a little ludicrous. Nobody has that force and dexterity and control of their hand, or a high enough grasp of physics to determine just how the dice is going to roll. So, since this is neither mentally controlled by us nor predetermined by a set of probabilities, this brings up an interesting question; what is the determining factor that makes a dice land six for a guy and earn him a million bucks? Is this not luck?

Probability. It's a lucky event if he wins that million dollars but luck does not influence the dice to land a certain way(i.e. to sum up to six).
Now, lets go hypothetical and say it was god's plan to have that man win the mil. He may tell the guy's sub-conscious to let go of the dice at a certain time, or move the dice themselves in the air but neither event really has to do with a natural luck.

jinxed_07 wrote:Probability. It's a lucky event if he wins that million dollars but luck does not influence the dice to land a certain way(i.e. to sum up to six).
Now, lets go hypothetical and say it was god's plan to have that man win the mil. He may tell the guy's sub-conscious to let go of the dice at a certain time, or move the dice themselves in the air but neither event really has to do with a natural luck.

Probability does not, as we've already agreed here, exist within the idea of dice-rolling because there are natural physical factors that determine which side of the die that it will land on. Therefore, probability is a stupid answer to what I've already said, because we know that it is not a factor of probability that determines the exact way that this individual throws the dice; it is instead everything leading up to that moment; every factor of his life, including but not limited to his physiology, determine how he will throw the die. He is not necessarily conscious or sub-conscious of the throw of the die, and since we're having a reasonable logical debate, I'm going to default to "God doesn't exist and is not influencing the side of the dice which appears." So, since he is not conscious of these factors and is not being scooped along by some sort of invisible hand of fate, is his luck not here determined by his lifestyle prior to the moment? His system of decisions and his muscle retractions?

SlappyMcGee wrote: I'm going to default to "God doesn't exist and is not influencing the side of the dice which appears."

So if you have a three-sided dice, and God's on one side, Jesus is on another, and the Holy Ghostie is on the last, which side turns up? Or does it spin indefinitely?


(EDIT: Lol, make that a cylinder.)

blue_tetris wrote:There is no luck, just the occurence of events we subconsciously wish to happen

That works for me. I avoid describing things as 'lucky'

I wonder if he knows where I got that quote from.

romaniac wrote:

blue_tetris wrote:There is no luck, just the occurence of events we subconsciously wish to happen

That works for me. I avoid describing things as 'lucky'

I wonder if he knows where I got that quote from.

I said that?

blue_tetris wrote:

romaniac wrote:

blue_tetris wrote:There is no luck, just the occurence of events we subconsciously wish to happen

That works for me. I avoid describing things as 'lucky'

I wonder if he knows where I got that quote from.

I said that?

Not on this topic, but if you ever did, then your suggesting that by wishing things I can use my will to make stuff happen. Somehow, that sounds unlikely.

SlappyMcGee wrote:a dice roll is entirely figured by the physical interactions it makes

I've read somewhere that there is randomness involved at the atomic level or something, but y'know, don't quote me on that.

blue_tetris wrote:

romaniac wrote:

blue_tetris wrote:There is no luck, just the occurence of events we subconsciously wish to happen

That works for me. I avoid describing things as 'lucky'

I wonder if he knows where I got that quote from.

I said that?

A while ago in fact
COFFEE
I saved a copy because I thought it was funny/interesting

As foolish as it sounds, I believe myself to be an extremely lucky person. There are so many things that could've fucked me up that haven't, like bike/car crashes. On top of this, I often win between $20 and $100 on the scratchies whenever I get them (infrequently), and I seem to be remarkably good at "guess the number of _____ in the jar" things.

On top of this I possess the "luck" that is noticing things others miss, like money on the ground.